One of the biggest frustrations we hear from RVers is how difficult and expensive it is to find an RV camping spot, particularly without advance reservations. People are always surprised to learn that, very rarely do Jennifer and I make advance reservations. Yet we almost always find a great spot, whether boondocking or in a commercial or government run campground.

Our guest in the interview of the week segment for this episode is Mark Koep, a fulltime RVer who travels with his family in a 44-foot RV. Mark seldom makes reservations either, even though finding spots for his big rig are more challenging than Jennifer and I experience.

Mark runs an awesome and totally free website called Campgroundviews.com that makes it easy to find that perfect campsite… without advance reservations.

I asked Mark to break it down for us, step-by-step, to show us just how it works. AZLso this week… lots of RV News… RV Lifestyle tips, Q&A and a great off the beaten path report from the Burketts.

Show Notes for Episode #258 September 4, 2019 of The RV Podcast:

WHAT MIKE AND JENNIFER ARE UP TO THIS WEEK

We’re coming to you this week from the beautiful Emerald Coast in the Northwest Florida panhandle.

We had a great meet and greet gathering Sunday in the Gulf Islands National Seashore.

The weather has been very hot and humid but very beautiful.

We’re getting ready for the fall RV show season. It starts next week in Hershey, PA, where we’ll be attending what is billed as America’s Largest RV Show. We’ll be looking at all the new RVs and doing meet and greets. If you’re attending Hershey we’ll be hanging out with our friends at the Leisure Travel Vans display there so come by and say hello.

RV LIFESTYLE NEWS OF THE WEEK

MIKE
Electric bikes now permitted on national park trails under new presidential order 
Did you hear that electric bikes will soon be permitted on trails in the U.S. National Parks? Last week President Donald Trump signed an order permitting e-bikes to be classified the same as bicycles so they can go on every federal trail regular bikes use. E-bikes are bicycles that are powered by petals and a battery to assist people who are older, have a disability, or maybe would just like a little assistance with pedaling. The move was opposed by many hiking, horse-riding and other outdoor groups who are concerned the electric powered bikes would cause people to go too fast and fundamentally change the experience on the trails. Personally Jennifer and I have had Rad Power Bikes for some time and we really enjoy them. We use them as regular bicycles, and only use the assistance when we need a little help. Here is a video we did some time back explaining how the bikes work. 
JENNIFER
Don’t get caught speeding in Yosemite National Park’s new wildlife protection zones
If you’re heading to Yosemite National Park this fall be on the lookout for signs marking wildlife protection zones. So far this year 11 bears have been hit by vehicles in the park. The zones were established to reduce collisions with wildlife, be it bears, butterflies, foxes, deer or other creatures. The wildlife protection zones will have a slower speed limit and officials will be strictly enforcing it in the hopes of preventing more loss of life.
MIKE
Article shows how the early days of RV camping began  
A fun article looking at camping 100 years ago captured my attention last week. The article, complete with pictures, talked about “Tin Can Tourists” and the early days of RV traveling. It showed how when cars were new, the national parks didn’t have official campgrounds. People could just drive in and set up camp wherever – even on the National Mall in Washington, D.C. It was a fun read and got me thinking back to the amazing display of early campers at the RV Hall of Fame and Museum. We did an article on it here, and highly recommend a visit. 
JENNIFER
Water pipe break at Grand Canyon National Park places entire park, including campgrounds, on water conservation mode
A pipeline break in Grand Canyon National Park caused the park to EDIT EDIT EDIT mandate strict water conservation measures in both the north and south rims that include eliminating water services at some of the campgrounds. The break happened last Thursday and until it is fixed, the entire park will be on conservation mode. The pipeline provides water to both the park’s 6 million annual visitors and some 2,500 park residents. EDIT EDIT EDIT If you’re heading that way this week, be sure to check in with the park for the latest on the water situation.
MIKE
RV News Shorts, Tips, and Reviews

This part of the podcast is brought to you by RadPower Bikes, an electric bike manufacturer offering direct to consumer pricing on powerful premium electric bikes. Now with free shipping  

LISTENER QUESTIONS OF THE WEEK

Question: Hello, my question regards RV names …class ABC. Why is it class B smaller than a Class A and Class C …like A should be the biggest and C should be the smallest. Love to hear from you. Love your show. Thank you. Bye.

           Answer: Here’s a link to a playlist on our RV Lifestyle YouTube Channel showing all the dufferent classes of RVs – https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLomKLKY-E0ScoGYTVWDsXgfnejcFAEdK1

            Here’s a video we did on What is a Class A Motorhome? – https://youtu.be/Uuzd38tSWLQ

            Here’s a video we did on What is a Class B Motorhome? – https://youtu.be/kHnlxv7Gjyo

            Here’s a video we did on What is a Class B+ Motorhome

https://youtu.be/aa8LeQwJqU4

            Here’s a video we did on What is a Class C Motorhome? https://youtu.be/aa8LeQwJqU4

Question: Yes, Mike. Thank you for the information about Channel 13 on the CB being used for RVs. I was wondering if it’s possible to also use the new family channels or the GMRS channels …possibly figure out which one might work for RV travels. Also the VHF ham Channel Simplex. A lot of people don’t know about it. Just another possibility for traveling across the nation. Thank you.

           Answer:  Here’s a link discussing about the Family Radio Service and the General radio Service – https://midlandusa.com/gmrs-or-frs-radio-how-to-choose/

            Here’s a link to more info on the General Mobile Radio Service – https://midlandusa.com/why-do-i-need-a-gmrs-license-how-do-i-get-it/

Question: Mike and Jennifer, this is Doug. That’s not too far away down in Hartville, Ohio, and I just wanted to drop a note to you. Just got done listening recently to your most recent podcast about with a question from a listener about firearms in the motorhome and carrying those and the legality of it and just wanted to make a couple of comments One mic. I thought you did an absolutely superb job of handling a potentially controversial Topic in just an excellent manner. No pros and cons here is here the facts and it made me think of a resource that that I was made aware of. I have no connection with this particular guide. I just I just found it to be extremely helpful in and looking at all of these issues associated with firearms in a motorhome. And I thought I would pass it on so you might be able to pass it on to your readers for those that are interested in this particular topic. You can find this particular book on Amazon. It’s called the 2019 Traveler’s Guide to the Firearm Laws of the Fifty States. It is produced annually an updated annually by the author J. Scott. Kappas as in attorney here in the United States and specializes in partner arm and it is a very, very thorough guide covering all 50 states and covers everything from carrying transporting weapons ownership of firearms, the permit reciprocity, loaded versus unloaded traffic stops, motor home and RV issues, just a whole plethora of really valuable information to keep anybody who’s interested in this topic on the right side of the law, which we all know is extremely important. And again, just wanted to say thank you for all you guys do for your podcast. I enjoy listening to it every week and look forward to the new episodes coming out and just thought I would pass on a little tip that some of your listeners might be interested in and find useful and from there. It will say. Thank you and have a great day.

       Answer: Here’s a link to the book the caller referenced – 2019 Traveler’s Guide to the Firearm Laws of the Fifty States

Do you have a question you’d like us to answer, or a comment on the things we’re discussing. If so, we invite you to leave us that question or comment on the special voicemail number we have for the podcast – it’s 586-372-6990.  If you are driving and can’t write it down right now, just go to the RV Lifestyle travel blog at rvlifestyle.com and scroll down the page. You’ll see that number prominently posted on the blog.

This part of the RV Podcast is brought to you by Battle Born Batteries, maker of quality, safe and reliable lithium batteries that can be installed in just about every RV. Get in touch with Battle Born to find out what lithium batteries and an upgraded energy management system can add to your RV Lifestyle. Check them out at https://rvlifestyle.com/lithium

RV INTERVIEW OF THE WEEK

Mark Koep and family have been fulltiming for 10 years

One of the biggest frustrations we hear from RVers is how difficult and expensive it is to find an RV camping spot, particularly without advance reservations. People are always surprised to learn that, very rarely do Jennifer and I make advance reservations. Yet we almost always find a great spot, whether boondocking or in a commercial or government run campground.

Our guest in the interview of the week segment for this episode is Mark Koep, a fulltime RVer who travels with his family in a 44-foot RV (that’s Mark’s Fifth Wheel in the featured image up top). Mark seldom makes reservations either, even though finding spots for his big rig are more challenging than Jennifer and I experience.

Mark runs an awesome and totally free website called Campgroundviews.com that makes it easy to find that perfect campsite… without advance reservations.

I asked Mark to break it down for us, step-by-step, to show us just how it works.

Mike Wendland:
Well Mark, thank you so much for being on the program today. And as I said in the introduction, camping, finding the right campground is right at the top of everybody’s frustration when it comes to the RV lifestyle. And I know of no one better than you and your campgroundviews.com that can help us find that perfect campground this weekend. So Mark, how do we do that?

Mark Koep:
Well, first off, thank you for allowing me to be on the show and speak to your guests. We’re campers. We actually started campgroundviews.com not because we were looking to make money but because we were having the same frustration that a lot of your listeners have, which is it was a pain in the rear to find a campground. We’ve been full time RVers years for 10 years. And it was about nine years ago where we first started running into the problems. We were using the normal sites that are out there, the review sites, to try to find campgrounds and RV parks. And we would literally spend hours and hours and hours just trying to find the right place. And so we’ve kind of built out systems, and we obviously built campgroundviews with the whole idea being that if you can see a park, you’ll know if it’s right or wrong for you.

Mark Koep:
But really that doesn’t matter. Your guests, your listeners, they’re wondering how they can actually find a camp this weekend. And so what I’d like to share is a few ideas on how to do that. So before I go there, let me give you some qualifications so you understand where I’m coming from, so that you know I’m not just making this stuff up. So first off, I mentioned I’m a full time RVer. I’ve been doing it for 10 years. The unit we travel with is a 44 foot fifth wheel with four slides. We have two trucks that we drive along with. So we’re not in a little van. We’re in a big rig. And here’s something that your listeners will find really interesting. We never make advanced reservations except for maybe, if we’re feeling like it’s a little crowded, we’ll make the reservation the day in advance.

Mike Wendland:
Even with that big of a rig? Even with that big a rig?

Mark Koep:
Even with this big of a rig.

Mike Wendland:
Wow.

Mark Koep:
And so I think that’s important to think about it, so you know that I’m not making this up. And so what I want to share with your listeners is kind of the steps we go through. Now, obviously our step one is our site, campgroundviews.com. We built it for ourselves and we felt if it was useful for us, it’d be useful for other people. So, [crosstalk 00:02:06].

Mike Wendland:
Let’s actually tell people how it works because when we talk about views, you can actually see these campgrounds before you book. Just paint a picture for them so they understand what that looks like when they get on the site.

Mark Koep:
So the biggest pain in the rear in finding a campground is that they’re so… If you go to the website of the campground, you’ll find one of two things. One, a photo of some random angle that doesn’t show you the campsite. Or, number two, you’ll find this really artsy picture that looks absolutely beautiful that you know you’re not going to see when you get there. And so the whole concept behind campgroundviews.com was, “Hey, let’s let everybody submit pictures.” Everybody’s got a phone, you can take a picture. And what we go for picture-wise is pictures of the sites, pictures of the roads, pictures of the amenities, the stuff that it’s not really Instagram exciting but it’s practical and useful. And so that was where we started at.

Mark Koep:
Since then, we’ve built up a library of 3,000 videos. These are shot by regular campers with their cell phones. They shoot the video, send it to us, we edit out license plates, faces, and put it back online so you can see what they look like. And we’ve since jumped into 360 video, and we have over 300 360 videos. We have all of the major Western national parks on video. So Yellowstone, Yosemite, Rocky Mountain National Park, Glacier, Grand Canyon. You can actually go see those campgrounds in 360 video, kind of like Google Street View meets video. And you should see some of the stuff we’re working on now. We’ve obviously taken feedback and we’re making it better. So that’s kind of our mission. Our mission is to make camping amazing.

Mark Koep:
And we believe you do that by allowing travelers, us, you, me, everybody who’s listening to this who likes to camp… We’re tired of trying to interpret reviews. We’re tired of guessing. We’re tired of ending up at parks that are not right for us. So our total goal is to try to help that along. Are we perfect yet? No, but we’re definitely working towards it, and we believe we have a really good tool. So that’s where I start my searches actually, at campgroundviews. And if you want to-

Mike Wendland:
All right, let’s do this, campgroundviews.com. And no charge, right? You can just use that.

Mark Koep:
No charge. Completely free. Yeah, go to campgroundviews.com. And when you hit that home page, you’ll see somebody with a pretty face looking at you and you’ll see a search bar there. The search bar is by location. And so if you want to test this out, I’d recommend starting out with Yellowstone. This is a really good kind of discussion point because one of the things you’ll read every season around the summertime is you’ll read articles in the major newspapers, you’ll see them on TV talking about how if you haven’t booked already, you’re not going to be able to go to Yellowstone, Yosemite, or fill in the blank for the popular spot. You won’t be able to camp there. They start out with those stories. Usually around the springtime, they’re good click bait. They get a lot of clicks, and so they put those articles out there.

Mark Koep:
So go to campgroundviews.com and enter Yellowstone National Park. You’ll notice it autofills a little bit, so select it and then hit search. And when you do that, you’ll go to a search page. And what I’ll do is I’ll drop down the radius. It defaults to 25 miles, I’ll drop it down to 50, let the results refresh. And within 50 miles of the center of Yellowstone National Park, you’ll see that there are 78 different campgrounds and RV parks within that 50 mile radius. If anybody’s ever been to Yellowstone, you know that you’re going to drive 50 miles just to get to the park entrance anyways. So staying 50 miles from Yellowstone is kind of par for the course, unless you’re lucky enough to get into Fishing Bridge which was closed this summer.

Mike Wendland:
That’s right. Right.

Mark Koep:
But if you can get into Fishing Bridge, great. But the point being is once I get into this tool, then I’ll start going for it. And Yellowstone’s a really good example. We have a lot of video, a lot of pictures, a lot of content. And that’s purposeful because we know for a lot of folks, the first place they’re ever going to go camping will be Yellowstone, Yosemite, whatever, so we focus on those areas first. And so we got some really good content there. But if it’s an area where we don’t have a lot of good content, maybe it’s the middle of the country, middle of Kansas or something, or somewhere like that, we’ll have the parks listed, and so from there what I’ll do is I’ll kind of see, “Okay, here’s a park, let me do a filter.” Because we have a big rig, I want a pull through, so I’ll drop the amenities option, click for pull throughs. That’ll filter out down the results a little bit. And now I have a decision set that I can go through.

Mark Koep:
My next step… Now this assumes that we don’t have pictures, we don’t have any content other than the park name. My next step is always to go over to a similarly named site, but a different site. It used to be rvparkreviews.com, it’s now called campgroundreviews.com. I’ll go there next and I’ll start reading some reviews and just make sure that it’s somewhat… And this is in the case when we don’t have pictures or whatever, I’ll start reading some reviews on it. And I’ll also do some Google searches, kind of filter around. But the key question is how do I get that campsite this weekend?

Mark Koep:
So once I get this list, honestly and unfortunately, the next step is to call the park. And anybody who’s ever tried to call a camp ground, you know this experience. You call that number, they’re not going to answer. You know what I mean?

Mike Wendland:
Oh yeah. Like I’ve never done that. Yeah, yeah.

Mark Koep:
They don’t answer their phones. And so what I do is I call, if they don’t answer, I call the next one. If they answer… Nine times out of 10, this is my experience. This is why I don’t make reservations. “Hey, my name is Mark. I’ve got a 44 foot fifth wheel. I’m looking for a site for Friday night and Saturday at your park.” Nine times out of 10, this is their response. “Well, I just had a cancellation. We got a site for you.” “Perfect, book it.” That’s nine times out of 10. Now, in the case where they’re like, “No, we’re full. We’ve been booked for months.” “Okay. Hey, tell me what parks in the area do you recommend for somebody like me?” And depending on the owner’s experience, they may say, “Hey, call, Jan down the street. They’re at X, Y, Z Camp.” And then I’ll give that campground a call.

Mark Koep:
Unfortunately, that’s the steps you have to go through for private parks. Now, a lot of folks don’t camp at private parks, they camp at Forest Service in National Park Campgrounds. This is where you have to get a little a bit creative. So out of the, I think there is something like 8,000 federal campgrounds, I think that’s the number, only half of them are bookable. 4,000 were bookable on recreation.gov. And you can go on recreation.gov, search and see them. And we’ll have them listed on campgroundviews and you can link over to recreation.gov and search their availability. So you’ll find that the very, very popular Forest Service camp grounds, those are booked way out in advance. You’re not going to get there on the weekend. But a lot of those campgrounds also leave aside walk-up campgrounds, first-come, first-serve sites.

Mike Wendland:
Right, right.

Mark Koep:
In that case, you do need to find the local ranger district number and give them a call and say, “Hey, I’m looking at, whatever, Tall Trees, a campground in the national forest there. How many of those walk-up sites are currently taken now, or as of your last check?” They’ll give you an idea. They might say, “You know what? Those sites never fill up,” and you’re going to be completely fine. Or they might say, “You know what? Those sites are already booked.” And then your next question is, “Okay, I’ve got a 44 foot fifth wheel, that park’s booked, what are your first-come, first-serve campgrounds around there? And that ranger is going to give you, “Oh, you know what? This campground right down the road, it’s never busy. There’s like three sites there that can easily handle your rig.”

Mark Koep:
And obviously I’m giving you a really bad example with a 44 foot fifth wheel talking about forest service campgrounds because they’re probably going to say you [inaudible 00:09:11] to fit anywhere. But obviously most people aren’t traveling around in that big of a rig. They’re traveling around in something in the 35 foot or less range. But knowing your unit, being flexible.

Mark Koep:
The next question we get from folks is they’ll say, “You know what? I absolutely need to be in,” fill in the blank, “on,” fill in the blank, “dates.” If that’s your requirements, then you need to book way in advance. If you know you need to be in Vegas on 4th of July, then book it as far out as you can. But if you don’t get it that far out, remember that a whole bunch of people did book that way in advance and the likelihood of cancellations on that weekend is usually really high. And so you’re going to find that if you’re flexible… And this is winging it a little bit, I’ll admit it. Some people need to have stuff planned and they need to know their exact route and, for those, they can ignore my advice and book way in advance. But if you’re willing to wing it, if you’re comfortable in your rig and you don’t care super about where you’re going to be staying at, then booking at the last second can really help you out a lot.

Mike Wendland:
So it is possible to find a great camp spot this weekend. You just have to be a little creative.

Mark Koep:
It is possible.

Mike Wendland:
I remember from the last time I think we had you on the podcast is you made a really good point that when people think campground, so they think the state parks and you know the big, the familiar ones, the ones they know about. But what they don’t know about is how many other campgrounds, that maybe don’t have big marketing budgets but are delightful places, are out there and just waiting for them.

Mark Koep:
What I love about camping, and it’s the reason why we love our business and what we do, is camping, and specifically these private park owners, it’s the last mom and pop industry in this country. It’s not corporate owned. You’re dealing with all these individuals. That being said, because you’re dealing with a lot of mom and pops, they have horrible websites. Again, they don’t answer their phone, they don’t advertise, they’re hard to find. And there are so many of these campgrounds around. Usually a lot of folks, they know KOAs, and KOA has done an amazing job of revamping their entire line of parks. But with that, they’ve increased amenities and increased prices. So some folks will complain they’ve gotten too expensive. And that’s fine. If you don’t want those amenities, you just want a place to camp, your options are a lot of these other individual, privately-owned parks that are located in all sorts of different areas all over the country is doing a little bit of research and finding them. And so we’ve obviously got them all listed, or a large volume of them listed, but they’re all over the place.

Mark Koep:
Now, let me throw a qualifier on that. If you’re in Los Angeles and you want to camp in Los Angeles, you ain’t going to find it because real estate prices in all the major cities have gone through the roof. It’s just not financially feasible to open up an RV resort in a major city. Name it, Seattle, Portland, Los Angeles, New York City, you’re not going to find an RV resort opening there. And if one does, you’re going to see the rates at $100 a night because the option, the flip side is they could have built a condo complex or something else. It is a private business. They do have to pay taxes and registration, all that stuff. So they have costs associated with it. The reason we love RVing is not to stay in Los Angeles, it’s to go to some of these places that are out of the way that are lesser known and so forth like Yellowstone. Yellowstone is great, but some of our favorite spots are towns like Dubois.

Mike Wendland:
Yes, yeah.

Mark Koep:
Great little town.

Mike Wendland:
Dubois’s a great cowboy town. Love that place, yep.

Mark Koep:
It is, yeah.

Mike Wendland:
And they have a couple of the best restaurants that I have eaten anywhere in that little cowboy town.

Mark Koep:
Yep.

Mike Wendland:
Yep. That’s great.

Mark Koep:
Yep. Lander, Wyoming, another perfect example of a small town.

Mike Wendland:
Been there too, yep.

Mark Koep:
Yep. And so there’s all these places around. And this one’s hard. Really, I guess this would kind of go to the folks who are planning their one, two week trip this next summer and they want it to be absolutely perfect. And so what happens is they go to Instagram, they go to Facebook and they say, “Hey, we’re going on a road trip. Where do we absolutely need to stop?” And they’ll get the big spots.

Mark Koep:
I invite people that, “Hey, yeah, you’re going from Southern California to the Black Hills for your trip and you want to cover that distance in 12 hours because you need to get there.” It’s not mathematically possible unless you’re flying in a jet, but nonetheless you want to get there as fast as possible. “Maybe add on a few days to that trip and start looking for some of the out of the way places, the places that not a lot of people stop at. And you might find that, number one, you meet a different group of people. You meet people who aren’t there on vacation, you meet the locals, you get to see the local stuff. And you get to have that experience that, honestly, I think Rving’s all about, is actually getting down and really reconnecting with not only yourself but this country itself.”

Mike Wendland:
Well Mark, as usual, I appreciate your insight and we’ll send everybody to campgroundviews.com. We’ll also link to the other sites that you talked about in the show notes. We always have a transcript of the interview. People can go back and click and check. Alright, Mark Koep, campgroundviews.com. Thanks Mark, it’s always great to have you on the show.

Mark Koep:
Mike, thank you for everything you do.

The interview of the week is brought to you by SunshinestateRVs.com, where every new  motorhome is delivered to the customer free, anywhere in the country

OFF THE BEATEN PATH REPORT   

Patti and Tom Burkett

By Tom and Patti Burkett

We heard from Tom’s sister that the West Baden Spa Hotel in French Lick , Indiana was something to see, so when we were in the area, we detoured to have a look.  The original hotel, the Mile Lick Inn, was built before the Civil War.  The area’s mineral springs had long attracted recreational and health-impaired visitors.  The last renovation of the original building included a two-story pony and bicycle track, an opera house, and a casino.  After that building burned in 1901, the current structure rose in its place.  While the resort features every amenity imaginable, the showstopper is a central atrium two hundred feet across, with a fireplace that burns fourteen foot logs, is ringed on the upper floors by the interior balconies of the guest rooms.

We hadn’t seen any of this yet when we arrived in town to discover the lane leading to the hotel entrance flooded by French Lick Creek, which runs along the edge of the resort property.  Heading into town, we were again turned back, as the creek had flooded the downtown as well, blocking traffic on Indiana Route 56.  There followed an hour of driving along various backroads looking for an accessible route into the hotel.  After ascending and descending numerous hills, we worked our way around to the uphill side of the Donald Ross designed golf course and finally reached the resort parking lot.

The West Baden atrium

If you’ve ever visited an old-style resort hotel, this will look familiar to you.  Many outbuildings house the staff and equipment for numerous outdoor pursuits, ranging from riding to archery, trapshooting to yoga.  The hotel itself sports wide porches for enjoying the water view and taking in the seasonal breezes.  Riding, cycling, and hiking paths spread out from the central complex, winding through a total of four high-end golf courses.  You can’t boondock in the resort parking lot, but just a few miles away is the Springs Valley Recreation Area, with several campsites on the shore of Tucker Lake.

The inside of the building, especially the atrium, is truly stunning.  The roof soars overhead, splashed with stained glass windows, and numerous seating areas are sprinkled below it.  Three restaurants offer fine and casual dining.  In mid afternoon we opted for dessert and coffee.  The massive Indiana stone fireplace was nearby, but not lit on this temperate day.  Oversized seating, couches and chairs, gigantic tropical plants, and impressive statues made the room feel more cozy and less cavernous.  The afternoon felt a bit like a European getaway, and it seems that was the designer’s intent, echoing the Baden-Baden resort in Germany.

For a truly out-of the-way town, French Lick has an interesting history.  The medical power of the sulfur springs was bottled as Pluto Water, a popular laxative in the early 1900s.  The resorts and casinos drew characters like Al Capone and Joe Lewis, and Irving Berlin was a regular entertainer.  Both the Chicago Cubs and the Chicago White Sox held spring training here during World War 2, and NBA star Larry Bird still holds the high school scoring record at Springs Valley High, his hometown school.

Nothing will get you to this part of Indiana except a desire to see things like this.  You can drop south off US 50 or head north from Interstate 64 and drive though the Hoosier National Forest.  it’s just miles of trees, lakes, small towns, and scattered gems like the West Baden Hotel.  Come see for yourself, out here off the beaten path.

This part of the podcast is brought to you by Harvest Hosts  https://rvlifestyle.com/harvesthosts a network of farms, wineries, museums and attractions where RVers can stay overnight, for free.